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Author: Subject: Soccer $$$ Insanity - [218 Replies | 9955 Views]
MySonsPlay
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posted on 10/1/15 at 01:24 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Anony

Quote:
Originally posted by Liverpoolfan9

This article should have picked someone with more of a dire need . Nice granite counter top in the pictures and their mini looks a lot nicer than the underprivileged that I know which have cars missing a hub cap or two. What about people with the broken down car etc that have very talented kids that really can't afford the pay to play system.

Pay to play is expensive, but if the article wanted to drive the point home, pick someone with a true lower incomes



your missing the larger point, almost everyone playing club soccer (especially at high school ages) are relatively wealthy households. This 146K of income I'll bet you is mean for kids >U14 playing club soccer.



This article was not condemning soccer and the pay to play environment, although Anony posted it to do so, it was a personal finance article showing how our extracurricular activities can wreck havoc with what is really important, education and preparing for retirement. The author could have easily used any number of other sports or even a families extravagant vacation habits.

[Edited on 10/1/15 by MySonsPlay]

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posted on 10/1/15 at 01:40 PM
My thoughts exactly once I watched the video. Having 4 kids ain't cheap extracurricular activities or not. I commend them in being able to save for college and have an emergency fund.
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posted on 10/1/15 at 01:42 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by MySonsPlay

Quote:
Quote:
Originally posted by Buzz




If all the money, and talent that goes into pay to play; instead went into the FREE HS system. Would that not be better for everyone.

To include the economically disadvantaged?



So your saying the cost is no different, they just need to be allocated differently. I bit too much of political statement for me.

I am a fan high school soccer, but I do not believe the high school environment alone will produce the level of player that players want to become.

Every high school sport, but American football, is supplemented by some level of pay to play.



Agree.

One reason high school is "free" (let's call it free for now) is that it's taught by gym teachers in an environment where for the most part everyone should get a chance to play. And the season lasts 2-1/2 months. And that's a fine thing. It's "free" and it's fun and it's high school soccer.

But it's the parents who are funding private, club soccer. So should the parents re-allocate their club dues to the high school teams as part of the "reallocation of resources"? What about the more talented club coaches; should they become gym teachers so they can provide better coaching (and I'm generalizing here - no need to comment on how great your high school coach is).

And with a high school season that lasts for less than 3 months, what should the kids do during those other 7 months when they're in school? Let's see ... they could go to private training with people who possibly have actual former playing experience, spending their own money to keep in shape for the next high school season. And they could train 2-3 nights a week on their own to get better for the next high school season. And maybe their extra-training groups could scrimmage against other extra-training groups as a way to keep sharp for high school. And maybe some of these extra-training groups could keep track of games and scores, just for fun. And maybe more and more extra-training groups from around the area could join in as more kids want to prepare for the next high school season. And maybe they could call their endeavor "club soccer" instead of "extra-training" soccer. And maybe they could differentiate between levels of club play so that the best players didn't train with the less experienced ones. And maybe the clubs could form a league and call it NC Soccer. And maybe the top kids, the better high school players, could call their group "Classic". And this is what they could do just to keep in shape and stay fit for the next FREE high school season.

That could work. As long as the economically disadvantaged can play high school soccer when August rolls around for the boys and February rolls around for the girls.

You never know.

[Edited on 10/1/15 by x-man]

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Buzz
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posted on 10/1/15 at 01:49 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by x-man

Quote:
Originally posted by MySonsPlay

Quote:
Quote:
Originally posted by Buzz




If all the money, and talent that goes into pay to play; instead went into the FREE HS system. Would that not be better for everyone.

To include the economically disadvantaged?



So your saying the cost is no different, they just need to be allocated differently. I bit too much of political statement for me.

I am a fan high school soccer, but I do not believe the high school environment alone will produce the level of player that players want to become.

Every high school sport, but American football, is supplemented by some level of pay to play.



Agree.

One reason high school is "free" (let's call it free for now) is that it's taught by gym teachers in an environment where for the most part everyone should get a chance to play. And the season lasts 2-1/2 months. And that's a fine thing. It's "free" and it's fun and it's high school soccer.

But it's the parents who are funding private, club soccer. So should the parents re-allocate their club dues to the high school teams as part of the "reallocation of resources"? What about the more talented club coaches; should they become gym teachers so they can provide better coaching (and I'm generalizing here - no need to comment on how great your high school coach is).

And with a high school season that lasts for less than 3 months, what should the kids do during those other 7 months when they're in school? Let's see ... they could go to private training with people with actual former playing experience, spending their own money. And they could train 2-3 nights a week on their own to get better for the next high school season. And maybe their extra-training groups could scrimmage against other extra-training groups as a way to keep sharp. And maybe some of these extra-training groups could for a quasi-league and keep track of games and scores, just for fun. And maybe more and more extra-training groups from around the area could join. And maybe they could call their endeavor "club soccer" instead of "extra-training" soccer. And maybe they could differentiate between levels of club play so that the best players didn't train with the less experienced ones. And maybe the clubs could form a league and call it NC Soccer. And maybe the top kids, the better high school players, could call their group "Classic". And this is what they could do just to keep in shape and stay fit for the next FREE high school season.

That could work. As long as the economically disadvantaged can play high school soccer when August rolls around for the boys and February rolls around for the girls.

You never know.


I am certainly not a gym teacher.
Nor are a majority of my the folks I coach with.
I coached on a Budesliga team in Germany for five (5) years. We almost made it to the next level. But not quite.
Most of the HS coaches, I coach with, are of similar or better quality.

Your comments are the typical way in which elitists have been keeping quality players out for years.

It is not a chicken and egg. Pay to play is not about development. Nor is it about increasing the skills of the players. It is about money. So, only those that can afford it 90% let's say, get to play.

Like I said. The system that exists is doing a good job. My only problem with it is that it seems wrong in my gut. Which is why I left.

My guys and girls go year round.

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posted on 10/1/15 at 01:50 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by MySonsPlay

Quote:
Originally posted by Anony

Quote:
Originally posted by Liverpoolfan9

This article should have picked someone with more of a dire need . Nice granite counter top in the pictures and their mini looks a lot nicer than the underprivileged that I know which have cars missing a hub cap or two. What about people with the broken down car etc that have very talented kids that really can't afford the pay to play system.

Pay to play is expensive, but if the article wanted to drive the point home, pick someone with a true lower incomes



your missing the larger point, almost everyone playing club soccer (especially at high school ages) are relatively wealthy households. This 146K of income I'll bet you is mean for kids >U14 playing club soccer.



This article was not condemning soccer and the pay to play environment, although Anony posted it to do so, it was a personal finance article showing how our extracurricular activities can wreck havoc with what is really important, education and preparing for retirement. The author could have easily used any number of other sports or even a families extravagant vacation habits.

[Edited on 10/1/15 by MySonsPlay]


What other sports? Do tell.

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posted on 10/1/15 at 01:55 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by MySonsPlay

Quote:
Quote:
Originally posted by Buzz




If all the money, and talent that goes into pay to play; instead went into the FREE HS system. Would that not be better for everyone.

To include the economically disadvantaged?



So you are saying the cost is no different, they just need to be allocated differently. I bit too much of political statement for me.

I am a fan high school soccer, but I do not believe the high school environment alone will produce the level of player that players want to become.

Every high school sport, but American football, is supplemented by some level of pay to play.

[Edited on 10/1/15 by MySonsPlay]


You are certainly entitled to your opinion, and I agree there is pay to play every sport. However, the statement that if Michael Jordan wanted to play soccer, he would not have gone to university to play soccer, he would have ended up in another sport, because his Parents could not afford it. Today that is.

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The Cynic
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posted on 10/1/15 at 01:56 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by x-man

Quote:
Originally posted by MySonsPlay

Quote:
Quote:
Originally posted by Buzz




If all the money, and talent that goes into pay to play; instead went into the FREE HS system. Would that not be better for everyone.

To include the economically disadvantaged?



So your saying the cost is no different, they just need to be allocated differently. I bit too much of political statement for me.

I am a fan high school soccer, but I do not believe the high school environment alone will produce the level of player that players want to become.

Every high school sport, but American football, is supplemented by some level of pay to play.



Agree.

One reason high school is "free" (let's call it free for now) is that it's taught by gym teachers in an environment where for the most part everyone should get a chance to play. And the season lasts 2-1/2 months. And that's a fine thing. It's "free" and it's fun and it's high school soccer.

But it's the parents who are funding private, club soccer. So should the parents re-allocate their club dues to the high school teams as part of the "reallocation of resources"? What about the more talented club coaches; should they become gym teachers so they can provide better coaching (and I'm generalizing here - no need to comment on how great your high school coach is).

And with a high school season that lasts for less than 3 months, what should the kids do during those other 7 months when they're in school? Let's see ... they could go to private training with people who possibly have actual former playing experience, spending their own money to keep in shape for the next high school season. And they could train 2-3 nights a week on their own to get better for the next high school season. And maybe their extra-training groups could scrimmage against other extra-training groups as a way to keep sharp for high school. And maybe some of these extra-training groups could keep track of games and scores, just for fun. And maybe more and more extra-training groups from around the area could join in as more kids want to prepare for the next high school season. And maybe they could call their endeavor "club soccer" instead of "extra-training" soccer. And maybe they could differentiate between levels of club play so that the best players didn't train with the less experienced ones. And maybe the clubs could form a league and call it NC Soccer. And maybe the top kids, the better high school players, could call their group "Classic". And this is what they could do just to keep in shape and stay fit for the next FREE high school season.

That could work. As long as the economically disadvantaged can play high school soccer when August rolls around for the boys and February rolls around for the girls.

You never know.

[Edited on 10/1/15 by x-man]



I want the government to run youth soccer in the good ol' US of A. The government does a fabulous job educating children and will do an even better job developing athletic talent. Some of the players may even be good enough to (one day)play in The Budesliga(sic).

I love people who live in their own little fantasy world,they are quite cute.

Just send your club dues directly to your local HS and in an instant you will see high-level coaching and an explosion in the quality of play.

Now,if you excuse me,I need to travel back to Reality Land.

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posted on 10/1/15 at 01:57 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Buzz

Quote:
Originally posted by MySonsPlay

Quote:
Originally posted by Anony

Quote:
Originally posted by Liverpoolfan9

This article should have picked someone with more of a dire need . Nice granite counter top in the pictures and their mini looks a lot nicer than the underprivileged that I know which have cars missing a hub cap or two. What about people with the broken down car etc that have very talented kids that really can't afford the pay to play system.

Pay to play is expensive, but if the article wanted to drive the point home, pick someone with a true lower incomes



your missing the larger point, almost everyone playing club soccer (especially at high school ages) are relatively wealthy households. This 146K of income I'll bet you is mean for kids >U14 playing club soccer.



This article was not condemning soccer and the pay to play environment, although Anony posted it to do so, it was a personal finance article showing how our extracurricular activities can wreck havoc with what is really important, education and preparing for retirement. The author could have easily used any number of other sports or even a families extravagant vacation habits.

[Edited on 10/1/15 by MySonsPlay]


What other sports? Do tell.



Swimming, baseball, lacrosse, track and field, volleyball, field hockey and even basketball. All of these sports have clubs in my area that are pay to play at some level and all the better athletes take part.

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posted on 10/1/15 at 01:58 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Buzz


I am certainly not a gym teacher.
Nor are a majority of my the folks I coach with.
I coached on a Budesliga team in Germany for five (5) years. We almost made it to the next level. But not quite.
Most of the HS coaches, I coach with, are of similar or better quality.

Your comments are the typical way in which elitists have been keeping quality players out for years.

It is not a chicken and egg. Pay to play is not about development. Nor is it about increasing the skills of the players. It is about money. So, only those that can afford it 90% let's say, get to play.

Like I said. The system that exists is doing a good job. My only problem with it is that it seems wrong in my gut. Which is why I left.

My guys and girls go year round.



NO, I don't keep quality players out. Both my kids play high school soccer. I keep them IN high school soccer. I just choose to have them play club soccer the other seven months because it's better than hanging up the cleats until another school year starts.

And not every high school is full of talented players. My kids play for a very average high school team with average-talented kids. They are two of the more skilled players, and they still LOVE high school soccer. But they like to train in the high school off-season with kids who are more at their talent-level. So that's why we supplement high school soccer with club soccer.

No elitist at all, I just know that club soccer in the high school off-season is a better option for them, even if they did have "year round high school soccer", which they don't.

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posted on 10/1/15 at 02:09 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by The Cynic




I want the government to run youth soccer in the good ol' US of A. The government does a fabulous job educating children and will do an even better job developing athletic talent. Some of the players may even be good enough to (one day)play in The Budesliga(sic).

I love people who live in their own little fantasy world,they are quite cute.

Just send your club dues directly to your local HS and in an instant you will see high-level coaching and an explosion in the quality of play.

Now,if you excuse me,I need to travel back to Reality Land.


Again your irrationality is obvious. Making comments about someone who has you on ignore. He can't see what you write Einstein.

Really, why don't you just get lost before the Moderators kick you off.

You are just a little child, who's parents do not supervise well. Go back to the sand box, and let the adults talk.

Funny you must only do this when you are at school, or perhaps you got suspended form being the way you are. The times of your posts tell the tale.

[Edited on 10/1/15 by psycholejeunefan]

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posted on 10/1/15 at 02:11 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by MySonsPlay



Swimming, baseball, lacrosse, track and field, volleyball, field hockey and even basketball. All of these sports have clubs in my area that are pay to play at some level and all the better athletes take part.


Well you can get a D1 scholarship in all those sports WITHOUT doing pay to play.
I do not think, that is possible in soccer anymore. I think that is the difference.

Do no not agree with that?

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posted on 10/1/15 at 02:12 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by psycholejeunefan

Quote:
Originally posted by The Cynic




I want the government to run youth soccer in the good ol' US of A. The government does a fabulous job educating children and will do an even better job developing athletic talent. Some of the players may even be good enough to (one day)play in The Budesliga(sic).

I love people who live in their own little fantasy world,they are quite cute.

Just send your club dues directly to your local HS and in an instant you will see high-level coaching and an explosion in the quality of play.

Now,if you excuse me,I need to travel back to Reality Land.


Again your irrationality is obvious. Making comments about someone who has you on ignore. He can't see what you write Einstein.

Really, why don't you just get lost before the Moderators kick you off.

You are just a little child, who's parents do supervise well. Go back to the sand box, and let the adults talk.



Buzz is not the only one who has this guy on ignore, please do not quote him. It might serve you well to do the same.

[Edited on 10/1/15 by MySonsPlay]

[Edited on 10/1/15 by MySonsPlay]

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posted on 10/1/15 at 02:13 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by x-man

Quote:
Originally posted by Buzz


I am certainly not a gym teacher.
Nor are a majority of my the folks I coach with.
I coached on a Budesliga team in Germany for five (5) years. We almost made it to the next level. But not quite.
Most of the HS coaches, I coach with, are of similar or better quality.

Your comments are the typical way in which elitists have been keeping quality players out for years.

It is not a chicken and egg. Pay to play is not about development. Nor is it about increasing the skills of the players. It is about money. So, only those that can afford it 90% let's say, get to play.

Like I said. The system that exists is doing a good job. My only problem with it is that it seems wrong in my gut. Which is why I left.

My guys and girls go year round.



NO, I don't keep quality players out. Both my kids play high school soccer. I keep them IN high school soccer. I just choose to have them play club soccer the other seven months because it's better than hanging up the cleats until another school year starts.

And not every high school is full of talented players. My kids play for a very average high school team with average-talented kids. They are two of the more skilled players, and they still LOVE high school soccer. But they like to train in the high school off-season with kids who are more at their talent-level. So that's why we supplement high school soccer with club soccer.

No elitist at all, I just know that club soccer in the high school off-season is a better option for them, even if they did have "year round high school soccer", which they don't.


Well I did not mean to accuse. I offer the DA system, that bans HS play. I agree, supplementing pay to play is good. Still I maintain, that every other country in the world, does not have it's best soccer development in a pay to play system, like the US, and especially NC does. That is all I am saying.

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posted on 10/1/15 at 02:14 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by MySonsPlay

Quote:
Originally posted by psycholejeunefan

Quote:
Originally posted by The Cynic




I want the government to run youth soccer in the good ol' US of A. The government does a fabulous job educating children and will do an even better job developing athletic talent. Some of the players may even be good enough to (one day)play in The Budesliga(sic).

I love people who live in their own little fantasy world,they are quite cute.

Just send your club dues directly to your local HS and in an instant you will see high-level coaching and an explosion in the quality of play.

Now,if you excuse me,I need to travel back to Reality Land.


Again your irrationality is obvious. Making comments about someone who has you on ignore. He can't see what you write Einstein.

Really, why don't you just get lost before the Moderators kick you off.

You are just a little child, who's parents do supervise well. Go back to the sand box, and let the adults talk.



Buzz is not the only one who has this guy on ignore, please do not quote him. It might serve you well to do the same.

[Edited on 10/1/15 by MySonsPlay]

[Edited on 10/1/15 by MySonsPlay]


Dave and I have been on this Forum for a long time. He takes it personal.

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posted on 10/1/15 at 02:21 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by The Cynic


A net worth of $678+146K in yearly income and they have $7K put away for college(for 4 children)...

They spend 150% more on soccer every year than they have in college savings...

They spend more on "entertainment" every year than they have in college savings..

There is no such thing as "free soccer" or a "free lunch"...funny how some people consider other people's money to be "free"...


You should let your parents do the talking Junior

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posted on 10/1/15 at 02:24 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Buzz

Quote:
Originally posted by MySonsPlay



Swimming, baseball, lacrosse, track and field, volleyball, field hockey and even basketball. All of these sports have clubs in my area that are pay to play at some level and all the better athletes take part.


Well you can get a D1 scholarship in all those sports WITHOUT doing pay to play.
I do not think, that is possible in soccer anymore. I think that is the difference.

Do no not agree with that?



No, not at all. Possibly baseball, but all the baseball players I know play a lot of tournaments over the course of the summer and fall that the amount of money spent on travel exceeds that of soccer.

lacrosse is just as crazy as soccer, volleyball is worse.

I am well versed in the swimming world, it is my families sports background. Very difficult to be noticed without the club environment. Last guy I know of was my college roommate over 30 years ago.

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posted on 10/1/15 at 02:25 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by MySonsPlay

Quote:
Originally posted by psycholejeunefan

Quote:
Originally posted by The Cynic




I want the government to run youth soccer in the good ol' US of A. The government does a fabulous job educating children and will do an even better job developing athletic talent. Some of the players may even be good enough to (one day)play in The Budesliga(sic).

I love people who live in their own little fantasy world,they are quite cute.

Just send your club dues directly to your local HS and in an instant you will see high-level coaching and an explosion in the quality of play.

Now,if you excuse me,I need to travel back to Reality Land.


Again your irrationality is obvious. Making comments about someone who has you on ignore. He can't see what you write Einstein.

Really, why don't you just get lost before the Moderators kick you off.

You are just a little child, who's parents do supervise well. Go back to the sand box, and let the adults talk.



Buzz is not the only one who has this guy on ignore, please do not quote him. It might serve you well to do the same.

[Edited on 10/1/15 by MySonsPlay]

[Edited on 10/1/15 by MySonsPlay]


This use to be a good place to get information. But a while back, Barry Pays my Bills , arrived and ruined this Forum. Now, most of the old crowd has left because of fools like this. I am sorry I quoted him, but dealing with a Bully like this is the best way to educate him.

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posted on 10/1/15 at 02:28 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by MySonsPlay

Quote:
Originally posted by Buzz

Quote:
Originally posted by MySonsPlay



Swimming, baseball, lacrosse, track and field, volleyball, field hockey and even basketball. All of these sports have clubs in my area that are pay to play at some level and all the better athletes take part.


Well you can get a D1 scholarship in all those sports WITHOUT doing pay to play.
I do not think, that is possible in soccer anymore. I think that is the difference.

Do no not agree with that?



No, not at all. Possibly baseball, but all the baseball players I know play a lot of tournaments over the course of the summer and fall that the amount of money spent on travel exceeds that of soccer.

lacrosse is just as crazy as soccer, volleyball is worse.

I am well versed in the swimming world, it is my families sports background. Very difficult to be noticed without the club environment. Last guy I know of was my college roommate over 30 years ago.


I do not know much about swimming. I do not know of a single baseball player on a D1 team that did not play in HS. I know plenty of D1 soccer kids that DID NOT play HS. That is my point. You CAN do it with soccer, I do not know of any other sport.

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posted on 10/1/15 at 02:32 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by psycholejeunefan

Quote:
Originally posted by The Cynic




I want the government to run youth soccer in the good ol' US of A. The government does a fabulous job educating children and will do an even better job developing athletic talent. Some of the players may even be good enough to (one day)play in The Budesliga(sic).

I love people who live in their own little fantasy world,they are quite cute.

Just send your club dues directly to your local HS and in an instant you will see high-level coaching and an explosion in the quality of play.

Now,if you excuse me,I need to travel back to Reality Land.


Again your irrationality is obvious. Making comments about someone who has you on ignore. He can't see what you write Einstein.

Really, why don't you just get lost before the Moderators kick you off.

You are just a little child, who's parents do not supervise well. Go back to the sand box, and let the adults talk.

Funny you must only do this when you are at school, or perhaps you got suspended form being the way you are. The times of your posts tell the tale.

[Edited on 10/1/15 by psycholejeunefan]



Her psychotic stalking does not bother me,but I am concerned about her frequent butchering of the English language.

"..who's parents". An average 3rd grader knows better than that.

I assume "form" is supposed(or suppose as you like to call it)from?

Your posts closely follow mine so using your logic(a scary thought)you must be in school.

It's October 1,don't you have a check to cash?

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MySonsPlay
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posted on 10/1/15 at 02:36 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Buzz

Quote:
Originally posted by MySonsPlay

Quote:
Originally posted by Buzz

Quote:
Originally posted by MySonsPlay



Swimming, baseball, lacrosse, track and field, volleyball, field hockey and even basketball. All of these sports have clubs in my area that are pay to play at some level and all the better athletes take part.


Well you can get a D1 scholarship in all those sports WITHOUT doing pay to play.
I do not think, that is possible in soccer anymore. I think that is the difference.

Do no not agree with that?



No, not at all. Possibly baseball, but all the baseball players I know play a lot of tournaments over the course of the summer and fall that the amount of money spent on travel exceeds that of soccer.

lacrosse is just as crazy as soccer, volleyball is worse.

I am well versed in the swimming world, it is my families sports background. Very difficult to be noticed without the club environment. Last guy I know of was my college roommate over 30 years ago.


I do not know much about swimming. I do not know of a single baseball player on a D1 team that did not play in HS. I know plenty of D1 soccer kids that DID NOT play HS. That is my point. You CAN do it with soccer, I do not know of any other sport.



But my guess is all those D1 baseball players supplemented their HS ball with tournament play, which is costly.

Heck, 25% of D! soccer players are foreigners, we know they did play HS. Sorry a small pet peeve of mine.

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